The Audacity of Pope

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[01:53] Thank you. [02:14] Welcome to Pod Save America. I'm Jon Favreau. I'm Jon Lovett. I'm Tommy Detour. On today's show, we'll talk about J.D. Vance's global face plant from Budapest to Islamabad. [02:23] Trump's new ploy to reopen the Strait of Hormuz by blockading it, his new war with the Holy Father, and his blasphemous depiction of himself as an AI Jesus. [02:32] How's that for a sentence? It's fucking, what a stupid era. Then we'll get into the big news in the California governor's race as horrific sexual assault allegations end Eric Swalwell's campaign in his time in Congress. We'll also talk about the latest encouraging sign for Democrats' Senate hopes. Throw some good news in there, right? Then Lovett sits down with our pal Nithya Rahman, the L.A. City Council member who launched a last-minute surprise challenge to Karen Bass about why she's running for mayor. [02:59] on a very Yimby platform. How's that? Yeah. Quick reminder, please consider becoming a Crooked Media subscriber, if you haven't already, so that you don't miss out on any of the great content we're putting out there for our friends of the pod. Subscribers get our new extra episode of Pod Save America called Pod Save America Only Friends. Other subscriber-only shows like Polar Coaster with Dan Pfeiffer. Access to all of our excellent Substack newsletters like Pod Save America Open Tabs.

[03:23] Ad-free episodes of all your favorite Crooked Pods. And you get to feel good about supporting one of the few independent, proudly pro-democracy media outlets left. [03:31] And Trump's America. That's us. That's us. That's us, guys. So head on over to Crooked.com slash friends and subscribe. We're past 50,000 now. [03:40] And so I just want to thank all you guys who signed up in the last couple of weeks to put us over the top there. Now we've got to get to 100. [03:49] Yeah, let's go. Let's pick up the pace here. Let's pick up the pace. [03:52] All right, let's get to the news. [03:54] J.D. Vance and his New York real estate duo did such a bang-up job negotiating with the Iranians in Islamabad this weekend that Trump has ordered a naval blockade of all Iranian ports in the Strait of Hormuz today. [04:06] and might resume military strikes, according to the Wall Street Journal. The 21 hours of direct talks between the U.S. and Iran broke down over some minor stuff, like the fate of Iran's nuclear program, control of the Strait of Hormuz, nothing big. Vance, who is just absolutely crushing his audition as future world leader, sandwiched a quick statement about the failure of the talks in between stumping for Hungarian loser Viktor Orban, [04:36] spiritual leader of his church, was insulted and attacked by his boss, the president. [04:40] Here's Vance in Islamabad. [04:42] We've had a number of substantive discussions with the Iranians. That's the good news. The bad news is that we have not reached an agreement. [04:50] And I think that's bad news for Iran much more than it's bad news for the United States of America.

[04:54] It's quite a good news, bad news there. He tried that again on Fox today. He was like, everyone's talking about what went badly, but not what went well. Right. He was like, you know, no, it's talking about how it's the first time, I think, since the Iranian regime took power that we sat down for face to face talks. It's like, yeah, why did that happen? Because you bombed the shit out of them and now they're holding the global economy hostage. [05:17] It's not good news if you've had talks, and then the bad news is that the talks failed, insofar as it's not good news if your plane flies almost all the way to your destination and then crashes. It's just that mountain at the end. Right. Inputs, outputs. Other than that, how is the play? Yeah. Kind of a situation. Anyway, while Vance was in Islamabad trying to negotiate and failing, Donald Trump was monitoring the situation with his Secretary of State and other important figures. Let's take a look. [05:45] I'll give you a heart of your look so good. You're too good looking to be a fighter. You are a sub fighter. Thank you, man. Thank you, sir. So there's Donald Trump in Miami hitting on USC fighters. [05:56] It goes on. He tells that guy he's hot like two or three times. He is hot. I'm glad he's confident. I see a kind of non-toxic version of masculinity on display. [06:05] A man can admire another man being attractive without resorting to sexual innuendo. That's how I feel. That's how I feel about it in the middle of a high-stakes negotiation over the future. Oily wrestling match. One thing for Donald Trump to be there, which is bad enough, but we don't expect much of Donald Trump. Very weird that the Secretary of State and National Security Advisor, and I realize he's from Florida, but just this...

[06:29] Hanging out with Trump in Miami at a UFC fight? You don't got anything better to do, Marco? It's ridiculous. Why isn't Rubio a part of these talks? Why isn't he leaving the talks? [06:38] Probably because he wants to stay out of it. [06:39] Too much Islamabad news. Things are going from Islamabad to Islamabad worse. He's like, remember, I'm the guy who got Maduro. The famous closer, Marco Rubio. I did that other war. So Trump claimed Monday morning that actually the Iranians just asked for another round of negotiations. [06:56] So who knows? Vance didn't seem quite as forward-leaning on that during the Fox interview as Trump did. But why do you guys think J.D. Vance, the closer, as he's known to no one, couldn't get it done in Islamabad? Tommy? Three problems, as far as I can tell. One, both sides seem to think or at least say they are winning. Two, trust. And then three, just major substantive differences, especially the straighter who moves in Iran's nuclear program. [07:26] Obviously, the U.S. is winning every military battle, as we often do, but we are losing the broader economic war. And the Iranians know that they can just kind of wait it out and continue to increase the economic pressure. And then on trust, I mean, the U.S., we don't trust the Iranians, but the Iranians don't trust Trump for good reason. He pulled out of the JCPOA, and then we in Israel have bombed them the last time we've been having talks, so there's not a lot of goodwill. Literally kills the people that we talk to sometimes. Literally killed the negotiators often. That's not cool.

[07:56] To do more bombing. Yeah. And then the substance like Trump wants the Strait Hormuz open. The Iranians want to de facto control it and charge a fee. And then the nuclear program, the U.S. position was reportedly end all nuclear enrichment, dismantle enrichment facilities and hand over the highly enriched uranium stockpile. [08:26] on enrichment activities, which is interesting because we were always told the JCPOA was really awful because there was a 10 year sunset. Now they propose a 20 year sunset. Um, but obviously, so if they took it, they could say, well, we doubled the Obama deal. Exactly. But the Iranians, we've all seen their 10 point wishlist. It's like, [08:42] control the Strait of Hamouz, sanctions relief, get the U.S. bases, close them down in the Middle East. So I think the Iranians think Trump's going to get bored of this. He's going to taco. He's going to give up. And meanwhile, the Iranians are like, we literally have nowhere else to go. So see you next time. Love it. Trump did say, right, as the negotiations were about to happen, the Iranians don't seem to realize they have no cards other than a short term extortion of the world by using international waterways. The only reason they are alive today is to negotiate. [09:10] Regardless of what happens, we win. We've totally defeated that country. Do you think that set the negotiations up for success? Like, I'm struggling with this just, like, watching all this unfold. Like, okay, so Vance is going to Islamabad for high-stakes negotiations. Oh, no, the negotiations have fallen apart, and now we're doing a blockade. But wait, the negotiations are back on, and it's all in, like, we're allowing, like, Trump's attention span to, like, describe what's happening. And, like...

[09:37] Oh, you didn't resolve this intractable situation in 21 hours? Of course you didn't. Oh, people have walked away, but they're going to maybe re-approach the negotiating table. Like, that's how these lost. It's a Subaru dealer. Right. It took two years to get the opiate. It took 18 to 20 months. Right. You're not trying to get to, like, a clean, like, lease terms where you roll it all in on the front end. Like, it's a complicated negotiation. There should be kind of complexities to take time to unwind. Like, oh, it's a stalemate. Wait, we're back on. And now we're blockading. Like, I don't know. [10:07] Who knows what the actual strategic logic is of a blockade, but if anything, it just shows that clearly they feel as though... [10:14] They need a deal that's better than what Obama got out of Iran. But because we fought a war, we have created all these conditions that require us to give on all these other things. They have to be in some way compensated or the consequences of the war have to be dealt with. And so what do you have to do to get to a better deal? You have to find some other place to ratchet up to pressure and make it harder for Iran to walk away from a deal. It all just to me seems like maybe it'll work, but it's an admission against interest. [10:44] He said, [10:47] I'm blaming J.D. Vance. If it does happen, I'm taking full credit. Honestly, that's where he's great. I completely – look, as I say to the team at Love It or Leave It, I cannot fail. I can only be failed, and I kind of respect that ethos from Trump. A double fail, though, from J.D. Vance after his little rally in Budapest. Yeah, it didn't go so well for the Torban. And he said that on Fox News. He was like, look –

[11:11] We can read polls. We didn't think that Victor was going to run away with it. He's on first-name basis with them. He's like, but you know, sometimes you just do what's right. [11:18] which is stumping for an authoritarian in Eastern Europe, I guess. Yeah, the kleptocrat in Eastern Europe. Also, remember a couple weeks ago when, I think it was Scott Besson said, we are jujitsu-ing Iran by lifting sanctions on them to increase global supply? Yeah, now we're blockading the strait ourselves. Well, let's talk about the blockade. Trump announced it shortly after Vance's bad news announcement, which the military then had to explain is not a blockade of all ships entering or leaving the Strait of Hormuz, as Trump initially said, but a blockade of Iranian ports. Trump also said that other countries would be joining us, [11:48] Once again, that hasn't happened yet either, though Israel approves. Tons of questions about what all of this actually means. [11:57] Thumbs up from Israel. That's two BBs. [12:01] Even Israel's like, are they helping with the blockade? No, but they're like, go for it. We like it. Keir Starmer's like, we're not getting dragged. Cheer you on. Tons of questions about what all this actually means, which Trump attempted to answer on Monday morning in the most natural setting. [12:18] to deliver the president [12:20] McDonald's. Here's how it went.

[12:50] We'll get it back either. We'll get it back from them or we'll take it. Is it your anticipation, Mr. President, that other countries will assist in this effort to blockade Iran and those? Yeah, other countries are going to also. Which countries, sir? We don't need other countries, frankly. Because your threat from before still stands. Yeah, I don't want to comment on that, but it won't be pleasant for them. Let me put it that way. Do you still... [13:11] Worst delivery ever. Can you imagine like, hey, sir, here's your McDonald's. [13:16] What do you think about men playing women's sports? He's like, I don't know, but can you just – I have to take a picture of this in front of the door. So I don't want to talk about – [13:24] trans but i do need to take a picture of this just for the app to get this through the app press conference fuck this guy well doordash grandma is so i'm sorry like it's a very dystopian kind of sad concept this poor woman being just like forced to do delivery i don't know maybe she enjoys it the whole hopefully maybe sad the whole thing maybe said if you told just you you sort of shake someone awake in 2011 and you're like donald trump's going to be president he's pretending he's jesus and accepting mcdonald's delivery at the oval office while uh talking [13:54] That's a joke. That's a 30 Rock thing. What the fuck are you talking about? No one believes that. That's not possible. [13:59] So what is happening with the Strait of Hormuz right now in this naval blockade? Anything getting through? What's happening? So it sounds like where the U.S. is going to blockade all Iranian ports and then Iranian-linked ships, not just flagged ships but ones that U.S. Intel says are Iranian ships, I think ships going to non-Iranian ports will not be stopped. So basically the way this works is there's like [redacted address]. The U.S. Abraham Lincoln is the aircraft carrier. That's kind of like the base of operations.

[14:29] with interdictions and boarding along with helicopter assets. And then you got the big ass guided missile destroyers, which will like, you know, block things and push them in one direction or the other and also do missile defense because they have all the missile defense systems on them. Then there's some sort of like mind sweeping and mind hunting operations that'll happen. And so the question I have is, [14:50] Is the U.S. going to be providing escorts to all the friendly ships? Because the average number of ships through the strait before this was 130 a day. That's a lot of ships. That's a lot of escorts. And this is risky even during the ceasefire because apparently the Iranians have lost ships. [15:07] contact with all their sea-based landmines, not landmines, their naval mines that are in the Strait of Hamus. They can't account for them. We don't know where we put them. You don't know where they put them. You never know. We kind of did it under pressure. Yeah, when some IRGC guy might fire off a rocket or a drone. But if the conflict restarts, I don't really see how this works because it's not just about the U.S. being able to defend the ships. It's commercial shipping owners and captains being willing to go through the strait while they're getting fired at. [15:31] Yeah, so you have also Trump. [15:34] threatening to blow up ships the way that they've blown up ships in the drug ships in Venezuela. [15:41] That's obviously indefensible in war crimes, but those are at least ostensibly, or their claim is that they're talking about ships that have drugs on them. This is just about commercial vessels that they're now threatening to blow up as well. Then on top of that, I think the threat was for like, because the Iranian Navy has been destroyed, according to the president. But that like if ships are going through like small, their smaller ships or their drones could still launch attacks. So those are the ships that they want.

[16:11] said multiple things that's one thing he said he was talking about the small attack ships he also made a separate point about going after any ships that try to violate the blockade which i look i hope that i have no he's he's completely unclear and the military's been clarifying it we have no idea what he fucking means we don't know how this is going to be uh implemented i hope that that's what he means but it's not clear that if a ship is uh not listening to a us everybody right like who knows and then the other part of it great is [16:35] Uh, [16:35] Are we now saying that we're going to have the U.S. military board ships that may be hostile? Like, this is also something that sets up a possibility of a whole bunch of horrible contingencies, troops being grabbed, people getting hurt, people dying in accidents because boarding a ship in the fucking sea that doesn't want to be boarded is a complicated endeavor. Like, who knows where this is going? It all puts him in a position, if he wants, to escalate and resume bombing and claim it's because of some incident that took place on the seas. [17:05] thing to be pursuing without really understanding why we're doing it. He's known to be a bit imprecise in his language. The military said it was the latter thing you said, which is that for the blockade, it's about them stopping and trying to board any vessel. Of course, that does raise the question, what happens when it's a Chinese vessel that's trying to bring oil to Iran or an Indian vessel? The Chinese said, we're coming. We have contracts and we're going to go get that oil. By the way, the problem is once you start operating the Strait of Hormuz, it's 21 miles that it's [17:35] the narrowest choke point, but the Iranians can fire missiles and drones from like anywhere along their coast. And your reaction time to respond to that with missile defense is nothing. So this is getting real risky. And just so people understand, like the purpose of the blockade, because I don't know if I explained it by block by having a blockade of all Iranian ports. The idea is Iran like has to get get its oil exported out to people who are buying it through all of its ports.

[18:05] And if it can't do that, then Iran is going to lose like billions and billions of dollars. And that is and obviously that is how they get most of their money. It's like half their, I think, oil and gas revenue is through the straits. It's through the straits. And so if you're blocking all the Iranian ports, they can't get anything in, can't get anything out. And that's how it also, by the way, like it could continue to squeeze the Iranian economy. [18:35] of the world depend on Iranian oil to some extent. So in the short term, it's also going to raise oil prices for everyone else as well as squeezing Iran itself. And the question is like, will, can the Iranians take the pain more than the rest of the world and us here in the United States, who are very sensitive to higher gas prices? [18:58] And so far they've shown yes. What are you trying to get out of a deal? [19:02] that iran is not currently willing to give you but that they will give you after two to three to four to five weeks of pressure from a blockade and like we just don't know i mean maybe that is known to them maybe they have some sense of what they're trying to achieve but nothing public has made clear what they're what the like what the point of this pressure is other than just to get to some sort of a deal i guess yeah it seems like their idea is squeeze the iranian economy even more so that either suddenly there is a popular uprising because now we're not bombing them [19:32] It's crazy. And that and so this will and then the leadership will say, OK, let's just make the deal and let's give up. Let's give up the dust and and make the promises and give them what they want on on nukes. And I guess reopen the strait and then maybe lift economic sanctions for the Iranians as well. And that's that's the that's the J.D. Vance, Donald Trump view of this. The dust is what he gave Justin Trudeau before he went off to Burning Man.

[20:02] nuclear material on Brett Baier. He knows, of course, that it's called enriched uranium. He understands all this, but he has to go, as some people call it, dust. One person calls it dust, you fucking idiot. There is a question of what does a blockade do? I guess it chokes off [20:18] the ability to have revenue to run the government. But yeah, the idea that people are going to rise up again, like the IRGC has all the weapons, the besieged militia has all the weapons, the Iranian people have nothing. And you've been bombing them. The history of blockades is it usually hurts the people more than it hurts the regime that's directed towards. I would also say, also just, and on top of that, I do think on some level it is about making the pain, making the pain felt outside of Iran too, to make other people feel as though they're kind of dragged [20:48] Yeah, force the Chinese to pressure them or something, yeah. [20:51] Spokesman for Iran responded to the blockade on Monday by calling it an attack on the global economy and asking, is it ever worthwhile to cut off one's nose to spite one's face? Trump doesn't seem too bothered by it. He's a fan of cutting off his nose to spite his face. Here he is talking to Maria Bartiromo on Sunday morning. So a lot of people mar-a-lac-o. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? They have a doctor that does that. You start with like $100,000. You come out, they cut off your nose, they spite your face, and you're done. A little filler. A little dermiderm. A lot of spited faces. [21:21] Spitted.

[21:31] I hope so. I mean, I think so. It could be. It could be the same or maybe a little bit higher. [21:37] It's so funny. The full range. The full range. At some point, did someone tell Maria Bartiromo, hey, you know, we can attach a lav to your shirt and you can speak naturally. She said, no, boom across the room and I'll keep shouting at it for no fucking reason. You have to mic on your shirt. You don't have to shout. It's crazy. She's like a real boomer with just the TV on constantly when you walk into the house. [22:01] the Iranian regime is posting these sort of like Confucius-like sayings about revenge, like lowering their head and saying... [22:10] Before embarking on a campaign of revenge, dig two graves. It's more than I can take from these people. I will say that. Along with some Lego movies. Yeah, they got us with Lego movies. Fire. [22:20] Got us. That was tough. That was tough for sure. Great lyrics. I was talking to someone today who works in an organization that does a ton of polling and research on Trump and U.S. politics and whatever. And they have consistently on a weekly basis. And he said, this is the first time Trump's approval has moved significantly in years, literally. [22:40] rock solid at like 43% approval always, right? It like moved a little around Butler, moved a little around Alex Petty shooting. Now it is in a straight line that is going down. And it looks like Joe Biden's approval a month after the Afghanistan withdrawal, which we all remember, essentially ended his presidency. And so maybe it'll come back. But it just seems like the energy shock is just getting started. Yeah.

[23:04] Oil prices are back up. And Trump seems to think, as you said earlier, he seems to think that he's like, ah, whatever. We drill our own oil. We'll be fine here. It's a global market. And then the Financial Times today had a report out where it said that U.S. crude exports will be up about a third this month. And demand from Asia is also increasing. So that's going to put upward pressure on all the prices here. It's going to hurt. It's already hurting. It has not. The real pain hasn't hit yet. [23:34] saying this and we're getting very close to that point where it's like you can look at the oil futures all you want but like the actual physical manifestation of the oil futures is about to hit um and i remember when we were in the white house uh david plough would always say gas prices are uh a hit to the entire enterprise yep and like the whole thing could collapse like the whole political project could collapse on gas prices and that's when they went up like [23:58] I don't know, a dime, five cents here and there. This is, I mean, you know, the parliament speaker, Galabaugh, that negotiated with J.D. Vance. He said, soon you'll be nostalgic for four to five dollar gas, as he's been saying. Also, on the Iranian point, I know someone I was talking to today reminded me that Iran prepared for this by taking a bunch of oil and placed it in tankers outside of the Strait of Hormuz.

[24:28] various places so at current prices that is 18 billion dollars uh so that's a nice little cushion for them what's funny about that is that they prepared for this yeah but um the united states which is the one that launched the war on its own timetable its own decision making uh did not refill the strategic petroleum reserve ahead of uh trump launch is only 60 percent full it's almost as if bb and pete hegseth uh [24:52] Trump persuaded Trump that this would be faster and easier than it actually was. Yeah, because we were watching Vance before we came in here and he said, you know, look, obviously gas prices being up is bad, but we had such a low benchmark and we were doing so good and it's not nearly as bad as it was under Biden. [25:22] probably were the one-two punch that kept Biden below in the low approval for the rest of his presidency. But right now, today, gas prices are higher than they ever were after that peak. [25:31] right now. And there's no hope that they're going to, or at least we don't expect them to go down between now and the election. So it's just not true. [25:38] historically more sensitive to price increases than they are even to job losses. And within the realm of price increases, there is nothing that people are more sensitive to than gas. And they have eyeballs and they see them everywhere. They are posted.

[26:02] Pod Save America is brought to you by Uplift Desk. You know, John, Tommy, and I share an office, and we all switch to Uplift Desk. And I'll be honest, I was skeptical. I thought, oh, are we going to use this standing up, sitting down? It seems so silly. It's not. It's great. We genuinely love it. We use it all the time. We're always in and out of the studio. We're up and down and up and down. But, you know, look, if you're going to be working at a desk, you're going to be sitting still. And sure, we're getting up and running into the studio and going to meetings. [26:32] content minds at our desks and being able to just say like, you know what? I'm standing up or you know what? I just ate lunch. I'm sitting back down. [26:38] They're great. It's really a nice thing to be able to do. They look nice, too. Yeah, and you can just change. It really becomes a nice part of working at your desk, and once you have it, you won't want to ever work any other way. You can assemble it in minutes, no stress, no mess. The new FlexMounted Cable Manager comes with every desk to keep cords hidden and tidy. So check out the new Uplift V3 standing nest, which helps you move more and get more done. They've upgraded everything to speed, stability, ergonomics, and design. There's a lot of customization options with the most extensive range of desktop styles and accessories in the industry. [27:08] how much we love it. Transform your workspace and unlock your full potential with the new Uplift V3 standing desk. Go to upliftdesk.com slash PSA and use our code PSA to get four free accessories, free same day shipping, free returns, and an industry leading 15 year warranty that covers your entire desk plus an extra discount off your entire order. That's U-P-L-I-F-T-D-E-S-K.com slash PSA for this exclusive order. It's only available through our link.

[27:35] Pots of America is brought to you by the Working Forests Initiative. The Working Forests Initiative is a cross-industry coalition promoting the role of working forests in driving economic growth and climate resilience. The backbone of the WFI's sustainability efforts is a diverse team of working forest professionals, from timberland owners to hiring managers and accountants, GIS analysts mapping the future of our canopy, and biologists protecting local wildlife. These experts ensure our working forests remain healthy and resilient. These are the stewards ensuring America's forests thrive for generations to come. [28:05] The foundational principle of working forest professionals is simple. Always plant more trees than are harvested. Planting is what makes working forests sustainable, and sustainable working forests are how WFI cultivates healthy ecosystems that reduce wildfire risk, protect biodiversity, and provide sustainable solutions for the future. The Coalition of Working Forest Professionals does more than manage land. They cultivate a resilient, sustainable legacy. [28:35] for our environment for generations to come. [28:40] So Trump was also asked, with DoorDash Grandma by his side, whether he regretted the Holy War he's decided to launch against the Catholic Church, the world's largest Christian denomination that includes more than 50 million Americans. The background here is that Pope Leo has been speaking out with increasing frequency about the church's opposition to Trump's brutal treatment of immigrants and his war of choice in Iran, which reportedly led to a meeting where a Pentagon official allegedly berated the Pope's outgoing ambassador to the U.S. Always a good thing.

[29:09] It also led to a 60-minute segment Sunday night where the three most powerful American cardinals, who were close with the American pope, spoke bluntly about the church's issues with Trump on war and immigration. [29:21] was watching 60 Minutes because right afterwards he posted a lengthy tirade that read in part, quote, Pope Leo is weak on crime, is a sentence that I will think about. It was like I was shocked, but I also couldn't stop laughing thinking about it. Me too. It's like they're on some debate stage in Iowa, and he's like, you are soft on crime, you are soft on nukes. Also, Pope Leo, wrong for David Axelrod. Pope Leo, weak on crime, weak on nuclear weapons. [29:48] And wrong for America. And friends with David Axelrod. That was a friend of David Axelrod. I sort of mentioned my name. I just talked to Axe today, but it was wild. It's like you meet with the Pope and then suddenly it's a – Like a rabbi and a priest walk into a bar in Chicago, you know? Have you ever had ham? No. Have you ever had sex? No. Oh, you got to try ham. You know? [30:18] Oh, that's nice. But I guess they didn't meet in Chicago. They didn't meet in Chicago. Anyway, Trump also warned the Holy Father to, quote, "get his act together." And he took credit for Leo's selection as the Supreme Pontiff of the Universal Church. That is Trump's doing. For good measure, Trump also posted an AI image of himself as Jesus healing the sick.

[30:45] Truly, like... [30:47] Did you just say like, no, but yes, [30:50] He really did. It's what, I mean... [30:52] I would love to just – we should have done a whole – we could do like a whole video on just going through the actual – The images as well. The actual image because it's an AI slop image for sure. There's a lot in there. There's a lot in there. There's a lot of confusing things in there. But what you really need to know, Trump, Jesus, healing a sick man in bed who could pass for Joe Biden. Or Jeffrey Epstein. Who could also maybe – yeah, mention maybe even more Jeffrey Epstein. I thought it was Jeffrey Epstein. I just didn't look at a divorce sloth. It also looks like there's like a demon behind him and maybe some G.I. Joes. I thought he saw a ninja turtle maybe. Yeah. [31:22] A ninja, definitely. Anyway... [31:24] Command mail. [31:26] So the pontiff was asked about all of this on Sunday night. Here's what he said. [31:31] I have no fear, neither the Trump administration, nor speaking out loudly about the message in the gospel. And that's what I believe. I am called to do what the church is called to do. Blessed are the peacemakers. I do not look at my role as being political or politician. I don't want to get into a debate with him. I don't think that the message of the gospel is meant to be abused in the way that some people are doing.

[32:01] stand up and say there's a better way to put this. The Pope was also asked directly about the post, and he did say that Truth Social was an ironic name for the platform. Not wrong. I love just a Pope in just Chicago English. It's so strange. The first American Pope, truly American. Yeah, it's awesome. Do we think he flies business? I thought to say, oh, he cares about the least among us. What's he flying? A nice-looking plane. What's he flying? Just kidding. [32:31] Woke Marxist Pope. Pope sitting next to Hassan Piker in Delta One. And Bernie. Bernie and AOC right behind him. [32:41] Here's what Trump had to say for himself when he was with DoorDash Grandma, which is what he calls Melania. I think he's very weak on crime and other things. I mean, he went public. I'm just responding to Pope Leo. There's nothing to apologize for. He's wrong. [33:01] Did you post that picture of yourself depicted as Jesus Christ? Well, it wasn't a picture. It was me. I did post it. And I thought it was me as a doctor and had to do with the Red Cross as a Red Cross worker there, which we support. I just heard about it. And I said, how do they come up with that? It's supposed to be me as a doctor making people better. And I do make people better. I make people a lot better. [33:26] That's such a funny lie. So many doctors. Just a health care provider. Just dressed as Jesus. It's one of those lies I'm like, why does anyone even spend time on it? Anyone with eyes knows that it's not. Even J.D. Vance was asked about it when we were watching Fox just now. What a couple answers from him on this. First of all, he said the whole thing was not newsworthy. The President of the United States picks a very public fight attacking the Pope, the Bishop of Rome,

[33:56] and weak on nuclear, and warns him to get his act together. J.D. Vance says it wasn't newsworthy. He said that of the AI Jesus, Trump was just joking. So it wasn't meant to be a doctor. No, he was joking about being Jesus. And people don't get Trump's sense of humor. And it's good that he posts his own stuff on social media and that it doesn't go through a filter of, you know, press assistants and people who work for him and everything else, because it's good that he speaks directly to people. He also said that the Vatican should stick to matters of morality. [34:26] Not the policies of the most powerful nation on earth as it retains to war, which I guess you mean like what? Like just no divorces in the rhythm method? Like it's just basically all that they want. It's so revealing that he said that. And I was like, I was thinking about this even before he said that is to J.D. Vance and to a lot of the right wing people. [34:46] Catholics and especially evangelical Christians in this country, issues of morality are issues of personal morality. And so that is why for so long they have been focused on abortion and sexual orientation. And so. [34:59] What Pope Leo and Pope Francis before him have revealed is that the core of Catholic social teaching is about matters of war and peace, is about preferential option for the poor, is about treating immigrants with dignity and respect and valuing life.

[35:29] personal morality issues that have become political in the United States. [35:34] look it's Thomas Aquinas over here look at this guy yeah Thomas Aquinas actually knows what he's talking about [35:40] The I'm like, yeah, I bad. Yeah. The I'm Protestant. Not since Henry VIII has a divorce slob. The Pope had overstepped his bound. But at least he didn't at least at least Henry VIII did Barry Ann Boleyn on a golf course. You know what I'm saying? [36:10] Muslims, which he has, obviously. There was the whole Muslim ban also in the United States. He's viciously attacked Muslims in the United States. He has talked about dual loyalty and has said plenty of anti-Semitic things about Jews in the United States. [36:26] There's [36:27] 20% of the country are Catholic in the United States of America. Is it that much? Yes. It is. There's over 50 million Catholics in the United States. There's a lot of Catholics. There's a lot of Catholics. It does politically, this feels worse. I mean, remember, this is not his first big fight with a pope. Remember, he tweeted about Pope Francis. If and when the Vatican is attacked by ISIS, which, as everyone knows, is ISIS's ultimate trophy, I can promise you that the pope would have only wished and prayed that Donald Trump would have been president [36:57] not have happened remember that one i forgot that's a wild one this one feels bad though politically like first of all it's like mood music like things are a little rocky for trump especially with this far-right followers like i don't know if you and dan covered the op-ed length screed attacking megan kelly uh tucker carlson candace owens alice jones from last week i read it aloud yeah so trump's biggest supporters are not in the mood to defend him and it also comes right after the um the easter tweet where he offended a lot more christians by us tweeting

[37:27] Allah on Easter. Yeah, he offended Christians and Muslims in one tweet. All over the... I started a little holy war there. And then, you know, it is an American pope. It's just like, what are you doing, dude? Yeah, he posted a picture of himself as the pope in May of last year. And I do think that, like, [37:43] He said... [37:44] And he's done, like you said with Francis, he's done this before. I actually think he's just doing it at a time in which he actually no longer seems kind of tough and blustery, but it just seems sort of sweaty. And so he's getting attacked from people that would previously have never said a word about something like this and would have done what Vance did and say, oh, he was just kidding around. That's our president. That's our big boy. But instead, they're actually saying what they think about it. [38:14] pointing out that Trump did not put his hand on the Bible when he was sworn into office. I hadn't realized that. I didn't realize that either. I don't know how I missed that. And it really, it built to an argument basically that Trump thinks he's God. [38:23] And he thinks he has God-like powers and that that is wrong and evil. And it's also it's kind of like kicking up a debate again about whether Trump is mentally well. And he was asked this at a press event the other day. Like people, hey, sir, people think you're crazy. What do you think? And my view on that is he's been like this forever. Yeah. Yeah, I just I listen. [38:41] It didn't make sense when I saw it as a kid, but as I get older, stupid is as stupid does. You know, I think he I think watching the 60 Minutes segment is what obviously that is what set him off. And there's been reporting on this. But it is worth watching. Everyone, Nora O'Donnell does a pretty great job talking to the three cardinals, the Archbishop of Washington, Chicago and New York.

[39:11] quote, we're dehumanizing the victims of war by turning the suffering of people and the killing of children and our own soldiers into entertainment. Cardinal Tobin called ICE a lawless organization. They hide their identities to terrify people. I mean, it was just, it went on and on and on. And I think that for Trump, when he hears that, he's like, oh, this is a personal attack and I get to hit back just like anything else. But it's like, what they are revealing is [39:41] compatible with not just [39:43] christian christianity and catholic social teaching but like most of the world's major religions because it is like based in like because they are based in empathy and compassion and grace and and banning abortion which he kind of already gave them so we're on the other side he gave him a pretty big win and now they're turning on him the side note not as important interesting the 60 minutes aired that piece given all the concern that barry weiss would be spiking anything kind of [40:08] critical of trump so i guess good that that made it through and the race broke the story yes they broke the story about uh them saying that they're going to get the papacy back to avignon yeah so like on the politics of this i mean i don't know if it'll do lasting damage like a lot of catholics might be like yeah it was weird he deleted it but he overturned roe versus wade so like we're good but it is interesting i think that once again the anger and the criticism falls into the character

[40:38] let us like be mean to the, you know, the cake artists who won't make an LGBT like wedding cake or whatever. It was like the people in true social saying this is desecration. Trump is the antichrist. Trump thinks he's God. [40:51] I've heard from people who have MAG relatives who are like, this was it. They were done. Yeah. [40:56] This is because it's it's the the the extremely political types who like their first issue even more than their Catholicism is abortion is one thing like you were saying. But I think for most Catholics, when you start attacking the pope like that and then you put yourself as a Jesus like that is a pretty it's it's a bunch. It's pretty blasphemous. Yeah. You know, and it is it's very Trump, too, because with Islam and Judaism, like there's like Catholicism has a head of the church. [41:26] And so there is someone, there is like a person who can be a threat to Donald Trump, who is a moral leader around the world. He's not used to that. He's used to just being like, see, that politician, like, they're just as bad as everyone else. We're all the same. We're all bad. And so it's – Look, not the first leader also just to think that, like, oh, what could the pope do? He doesn't have any armies or anything. I do wonder if maybe Trump could maybe like – [41:51] go on the road to Canossa and then walk all the way to the castle and then take his shoes off and then beat on the doors for a few days until the Pope lets him in. And then he can apologize. And then the Pope would absolve him. And then he could go back to Canossa. [42:04] leading the Holy Roman Empire. Yeah, that's a good idea. Empire, what about that? I think that's a good idea. That's really good. Did you see the other interesting thing before we move off on the CBS, on the 60 Minutes thing, is that the Pope has decided to spend the 4th of July in Lampedusa, which is the Italian island where tens of thousands of migrants have landed on their way to Europe. And Nora asked if that was symbolic. They're like, yeah, of course. He's like, no, no, they have great spritzes there.

[42:34] It's beautiful because it's on the coast, it's on the waters, the waters really chill on that side. It's not too hot. Your hair doesn't get curly. It's nice. It's like, what a contrast with, you know, Donald Trump celebrating July 4th with what he's going to do. His bacchanal of like literal violence, like UFC matches. And he's meanwhile welcoming migrants to the shore, which is what, you know, as one of the Cardinals said, which is what the Statue of Liberty is supposed to represent. Also tough for Vance's I Became Catholic book tour. [43:01] Yeah. Big time. Yeah. Like I said, my road, what's it called? The road home. It's taking the long road back to Catholicism. So I only know about Catholicism up to the Reformation. That's where the end of my memory of AP European history cuts off. It's going to really ruin the book tour for J.D. Vance. What is it called? Communion. Oh, Communion, Finding My Way Back to Faith. He found his way back. How many books about himself is that guy going to write? Jesus Christ. There's too many already. [43:31] bud. [43:41] Pod Save America is brought to you by Mill. I never thought I'd be excited about food scraps. I did. Until we got a mill at the office kitchen. It's changed how we manage food waste here at Cricut HQ. Mill is the odorless, effortless, fully automated food recycler. Potato peels, avocado pits, chicken bones, even dairy. Mill takes almost anything while you sleep. Mill quietly transforms food scraps into nutrient-rich, shelf-stable grounds. No mess, no smells, no fruit flies. Mill can process up to 10 pounds overnight, and it can work for weeks

[44:11] You can use the grounds in your garden, add them to curbside compost, or Mill can even pick them up and get them to a small farm for you. The Mill app even tracks how much food you recycle, so you can see your impact on diverting food waste from landfills. Plus, Mill offers a 90-day risk-free trial. [44:25] So if you don't absolutely love it, you can send it back. We have a mill recycler in the crooked kitchen. Here are some of our stats. We average 53 pounds recycled each month. Total of 168 pounds of food scraps recycled since January. Zevi takes the food grounds home and uses it in her garden. And Zevi has chickens. [44:41] chickens. Try mill free for 90 days and get $75 off at mill.com slash crooked and use code crooked. That's $75 off at mill.com slash crooked and use the code crooked. [44:54] Pod Save America is brought to you by Policy Genius. Spring is a season of growth and renewal, the perfect time to ensure the life you're building is protected. Keeping your loved ones secure is a top priority, and Policy Genius makes finding the right insurance policy straightforward and simple. Policy Genius is an online insurance marketplace that allows you to compare quotes from some of America's top insurers side-by-side for free. Their licensed team helps you get what you need fast so you can get on with your life, easily find what you need, coverage, amounts, prices, terms, no guesswork, just clarity.

[45:24] They answer questions, handle paperwork, and advocate for you throughout the process. Policy Genius has thousands of five-star reviews on Google and Trustpilot from customers who found the best policy fit for their needs. Protect your family with a policy that grows with your life. With Policy Genius, you can see if you can find 20-year life insurance policies starting at just $276 a year for $1 million in coverage. Head to policygenius.com slash crooked to compare life insurance quotes from top companies and see how much you could save. That's policygenius.com slash crooked. [45:53] All right, let's get to the big development here in the California governor's race. Eric Swalwell, who was one of the leading candidates, has dropped out after four women accused the congressman of sexual misconduct, including a former staffer who has offered a detailed and corroborated account of Swalwell raping her in a New York hotel room after a night of heavy drinking in 2024. [46:23] into the allegations. Swalwell was initially defiant, but after losing most of his endorsements, he ended his campaign on Sunday night, writing in a statement on X that he was, quote, deeply sorry for mistakes in judgment and that he, quote, will fight the serious false allegations that have been made. [46:38] Just before we recorded, Swalwell also resigned from Congress. What are your reactions to both the news and, in general, it's secondary, but just the audacity to run for governor knowing that this was out there? Yeah, I mean, it was shocking. I mean, I think there were a lot of rumors about Eric Swalwell kind of being...

[46:57] uh, one of the younger members of Congress who would go to bars, get too drunk, hang out with staffers, maybe fraternize with them in inappropriate ways, but nothing. I'd never heard anything like this. So I read that CNN story and I thought he should drop out of the race. He should resign from Congress. Then he should hire a criminal defense attorney because there's a damn good chance that guy gets prosecuted, uh, and could see jail time. And then shortly after, uh, the Manhattan district attorney announced an investigation. So, um, I, you know, [47:24] It's horrible. I'm glad the Democratic Party moved quickly to to push him out. It's a nice it's a contrast with how the Republicans operate and the Tony Gonzalez to Trump to many in between. But it's despicable. Yeah, it was at first. Swallow was issuing these denials that's that reference to mistakes in judgment. But that, oh, he'd never done NDAs and had never been members of staff. And then. [47:45] Those were, I think, disproven, or at least there was reporting that showed that those weren't true. So then those statements sort of changed. It's hard to get into the mind of somebody that would have this in their past and think that they could run for governor, because you can't even say, oh, he, because it's like, this is not, [48:03] Um, [48:05] Like, I don't know what stories people tell themselves, but he's not the first person to have terrible skeletons in their closet and still believe that they could do whatever they want and keep rising and be brazenly ambitious. [48:15] And right up to the end, like the video he recorded reportedly at some billionaire donors home in Beverly Hills, like his staff wasn't around where he like refused to drop out and said he was going to stay in it. It's like the the woman who came forward on this.

[48:34] Um, she, if you read the CNN story in the San Francisco Chronicle story, like she has text messages to a friend, um, saying that she was sexually assaulted by Eric Swalwell saying exactly what happened. Like right after it happened in 2024, she had told multiple family members, her partner at the time. And then you have three other women having similar, saying similar things. [49:04] STDs and had the person at the lab send her a note that said, like, you're a survivor, hang in there. I mean, just like, there's so much... A lot of it. A lot of it. A lot of corroboration. And to, like, read that story as Eric Swalwell and to, like, see the other ones and just be like, I'm going to film a video being like, fuck it. I'm hanging in here. And then his lawyer gave this insane... Attacking the victims. ...interview with Alex Michelson on CNN. And Alex did a great job. But it was just, like, it was so hard to watch because he just was, like, sitting there not giving any answers on anything. It's like, why did you even go on TV? [49:34] Yeah, we've seen like a lot. I also just like there's a story I think people tell themselves that, oh, like I've been, you know, I've look, I've stepped outside of my marriage and I've had been unfaithful, but I've never done anything like I've never been hurt anybody.

[50:04] to people. [50:05] Yeah. And there was a story in, I think it was the Times, about, you know, it's indicative, like, this whole thing was indicative of how, what a shit show the California governor's race has been. And people were, like, clamoring to get behind some kind of candidate because Kamala didn't run and Padilla didn't run. And so, Swalwell comes and then they're all like, okay, this is our guy, this is our guy. [50:35] denials and his categorical denials, even in private, like one-on-one before endorsements were like so intense that they were like, okay, I guess he's saying absolutely not. Nothing's going to come out. You know, MAGA's been after me for a while. Wouldn't they have surfaced this already? Well, there was also this thing where, you know, there was a report that... [50:51] Cash Patel was going to put the Eye of Sauron from the FBI on Swalwell and inappropriately release investigative files. [51:00] There was also, I think, legitimate concern that maybe the Trump administration was going to use the power of the government in some inappropriate way to target him, which I think led to maybe... [51:11] more second chances for him but then also i was thinking back to that weird video he released with his wife where they're like walking in santa monica and it's like his wife like endorses his candidacy and we're like like what is this what is the context and it's just like so clear that that was running these um controversies by the way as we were recording uh cnn and some others reporting that uh in battle gop rep tony gonzalez announces he's stepping down from congress so

[51:41] like the Swalwell thing brought up these other House members who they all thought that they maybe would try to expel together. So there's Swalwell, Gonzalez, who had had an affair with the staffer who later committed suicide, Democrat Sheila Chirfilis-McCormick, who the House Ethics Committee found guilty of stealing COVID relief funds for her campaign, Republican Cory Mills, who's under investigation for committing campaign fraud and sexual misconduct and domestic violence. [52:11] uh, Gonzalez, uh, has said he's going to resign, retire tomorrow. And so now I don't know if the vote will go forward on, um, Turfellis, McCormick and Mills or the whole thing will get dropped. But, um, wow. So there's a lot about the house just to come. It's like, Oh, someone did something bad. Let's get them all together. Let's expel them all. Yeah. It's a, there's such a, um, cause like Santos was basically the first person expelled since what? Like, uh, reconstruction. Yeah. And with that, it was like, Oh, well, well, it's so obvious that you should have this person removed. Cause it's just so brazen. [52:41] There's so many examples. But the idea there's something so like, look, I'm glad Swalwell's resigning. All these other people should be resigned and expelled. But there's something so ugly about like, oh, we have to do it in pairs because we're only going to enforce our ethics in a bipartisan way, which tells you that actually what you need is some kind of a standard or process at the end of which there's a there's a way in which you say, all right, this is this standard has been met. We will vote to expel that won't be kind of abused or politicized or ignored by either side.

[53:11] They say, like, well, we need we need either the House Ethics Committee to have completed an investigation and find the person guilty through the House Ethics Committee or like an actual criminal conviction. That's some kind of legal determination. Right. Because you do want that, because otherwise, then everyone's going to start saying, oh, you did this. You did this. Expelled. Right. Like the evidentiary standard. And like. And by the way, like, I'm glad, too, that there was genuine reporting that dug in. Like because there were like random posts on social media. Like, oh, Swalwell is a creep. And someone like this is just a hit piece. This is by the opponents. And it's impossible to know. Like, we're just trying. We don't know. You can't go by that. [53:41] Right. And so I'm... [53:42] Thankfully, these women came forward. Yeah. So it sort of was a combination of... [53:47] People kind of drumming this up online, including people sort of outside of traditional journalism, and then it getting kind of a kind of journalistic outlets sort of putting in the resources to go and kind of run these things down, which ultimately I think is why it was able to successfully make the story breakthrough and get him to resign. So let's talk about what happens now in the California governor's race. We can do, you know, J.D. Vance, good news, bad news. Bad news is this. Bad news is that guy. Good news is I feel like the lockout fears are over at this point. I don't know. [54:17] revive them. We can get to that.

[54:28] California is roughly 60-40 state, Democrats, Republicans. So you have two Republicans splitting the 40, but one endorsed by Donald Trump. And then now you have... [54:41] Tom Steyer, [54:43] Katie Porter, and then I guess, you know, Matt Mahan is the mayor of San Jose, Javier Becerra, former AG. [54:53] and Biden administration cabinet member and Antonio Viragosa, former mayor of L.A., sort of vying for, you know, the third spot. What do you guys think? So most of the people I've talked to in the California political world since the Swalwell News think that this race will go down to, on the Democratic side, Steyer versus Katie Porter. Katie Porter's campaign has said, I think, to Politico today that they, in their internal polls, they get half of Swalwell's vote. Steyer's team, I think, said they get a quarter of Swalwell's vote. [55:23] we'll see um the problem for katie porter is no matter how much she raises or how hard she campaigns in the next couple weeks like it's going to be impossible to match the 120 million that steyer has already spent and the problem for steyer is he spent 120 million and he's still kind of stuck yeah he was spending millions attacking swalwell which at this point means he has set that money was just wasted yeah and so the most of the candidates as you said are [55:53] a ton of money from [55:56] A bunch of tech industry billionaires already has, but may get a ton more.

[56:00] Maybe that'll move the needle. The problem for him is that like California is so big. We have, what, 10 media markets. They're all expensive. Even spending 20 million is like not going to get you that much. So, you know, that's the assumption of where this will set you out. Now, the good news for all of us is everyone's in the field right now with polls, campaigns, media organizations, PACs. Hopefully we'll get some new data. I think the scary scenario is a situation where you have Mahan, Porter, and Steyer all splitting the Dem vote. Then you could see a [56:30] It is more likely, I think, that the Democratic Party comes in or the DGA comes in and elevates Steve Hilton further in some way to ensure that it's a Republican Democrat. [56:42] general election, but we'll see. Yeah. And the chat and the reason that it seems unlikely that there's going to be a lockout now is if you've got so Becerra, Viragosa and Mahan have like maybe in one or two polls, one of them has has hit five. No one's gotten to more than five. Right. So say you generously give all the candidates who aren't. [57:04] Porter and Steyer, 15%. [57:06] That still is 45 percent between Steyer and Porter and divided by two is as long as they're over 20. Neither Chad Bianco or Steve Hilton is getting over 20 percent because it's, you know, it's 40 percent of the voters are Republicans in California. Yeah. The argument for this kind of all redounding to Porter is. [57:28] Steyer has spent whatever it is, over $100 million. He's gotten to wherever he's gotten. He's gotten billions of impressions, and he's sort of stuck where he is. Katie Porter hasn't really spent anything. She's spent very little on ads, and I hope that this would be an opportunity to go spend that money.

[57:43] Before you even get to where the voters go, where does Swalwell money go? It doesn't make sense to go to Tom Steyer. He's a fucking billionaire. With Matt Mahan. Maybe. [57:53] Some of them. Matt Mahan is a lot of the tech-focused... [57:59] people, you know, so he's got a lot of money, uh, surrounding on that campaign. Now, again, he's got some similar issue with Steyer. He's jumped in the race later, but a lot of money spent and still sitting around four or 5%. I feel like, I don't know. Maybe we'll see. But like the idea that there's a bunch of people that were behind Eric Swalwell are now suddenly going to go to them. We're kind of like, they're not going to go to the other traditional them in the race. I don't know. We'll see. But, uh, [58:20] It does seem like it's a moment for Katie Porter to spend some money and try to figure out how to kind of bump herself up. I'm sure she's been waiting because she's so outgunned by Steyer. At some point in this environment where attention matters most and people barely watch ads, I do think finding a moment to capture attention is more important in some ways than Tom Steyer has found out. And then spending a whole bunch of money. And it's a challenge in a statewide race, especially a state as big as California, because you have a huge state. [58:50] but everyone's talking about national politics all the time. And we have a couple of big debates coming up. And do we think California voters are all going to be tuning into those debates? [58:58] You'd hope so, but I don't know. Because we have Forum tomorrow night. [59:02] which will be the first time I think they've all been together, to comment on Swalwell. And I do think that will be a newsmaking thing, and we'll see something coming out there. [59:09] Luckily, there's lots of better news for Democrats to focus on. On Monday, the Cook Political Report shifted its outlook for several key Senate races in Democrats' direction. North Carolina and Georgia, this is wild, from toss-up to lean Democrat. Ohio, from lean Republican to toss-up. And Nebraska, from solid Republican to lean Republican.

[59:39] Um, where there are two strong Democrats in a tough primary over in Alaska, Mary Peltola raised almost $9 million in the first three months of the year, quadruple the amount raised by Republican incumbent Dan Sullivan, probably the most money ever raised in that state. Um, [59:52] Do you guys think the Democrats' chance of taking back the Senate has been underrated? I feel like it might have been underrated by now. It might have been underrated. Yeah, I'm just picturing an Ayatollah. [1:00:01] Coming to the microphone the day after the election and saying, we didn't set out to change the American regime, but the regime did change. [1:00:08] It's interesting to think about. Yeah, I don't know if it's underrated other than it was rated correctly. And then we launched a war and gas prices are through the roof. And now it needs to be rated according to what's happened. It's been overtaken by events. It was maybe a toss-up when gas was $3 a gallon. If it's $5 or $6 a gallon, suddenly the Senate is not just in play, but we have a real, real chance of taking it. [1:00:31] I've long felt pretty optimistic about North Carolina and Georgia just because like those are great candidates in states that are genuinely swingy. Ohio and Iowa. [1:00:40] Tough states in 2024. I think Trump won Ohio by 11 points, won Iowa by 13 points. Some big head wins. But Ohio, we got Sherrod Brown. He's probably the best candidate we could ask for. He's going to win the primary, but he's going to win the primary. And then in Iowa, we will not have a candidate until June 2nd. I interviewed Josh Turret a couple weeks ago. Folks want to listen to that. We're up to Zach Walls to try to get him on soon, too. But Iowa Democrats have a really strong candidate at the top of the ticket in Rob Sand, who is reportedly up eight points.

[1:01:10] And between high gas prices, high fertilizer prices, and then tariffs, Trump has done everything he can to piss off farmers and fuck over Iowa's economy. So there's just a lot of... [1:01:24] you know, tailwinds for these candidates. We should know that Cook, in the same breath as moving those races, also still doesn't think the Democrats are favored to win the Senate, because they basically think... [1:01:35] we'll pick up one to three, we need four. And so there must be counting [1:01:39] main, um, [1:01:42] North Carolina, and then either Ohio or Alaska or Iowa, and not two of the three. Now, I think Texas is a good chance, too, but they don't rate Texas as – I think Texas is still lean Republican in their ranking, if I'm remembering correctly. I would also like to see – part of this, too – who does gas prices hit? Obviously, geographically, it's going to hit states where people are driving a longer distance or driving bigger cars. [1:02:12] that were kind of soft Trump voters and are now open to voting for a Democrat. It's going to be people that they're not driving Teslas. They're driving SUVs and they find Democrats talking about these issues pretty annoying, but they're pretty fucking pissed about how expensive gas is because we went to war and run. [1:02:30] And it's not just gas. It'll be, you know, supply shortages and the cost of other, I mean, inflation is still a problem. It's going to be a big problem. And then the argument that why are we spending X billions on bombs to drop on schools in Iran when we could be spending it on anything else here, like pulls through the roof and everyone's going to be able to use that. Right. Like, wait till we find out how much this blockade is going to cost us a day.

[1:02:49] Billions. [1:02:50] Trump, right before the election in Hungary, was promising economic help for Hungary if they elect Viktor Orban. Which he's done so many times. Remember the beef, the Argentinian beef. Yeah, Argentinian bailout. He keeps doing that. It's insane. Brazen election interference. Then J.D. Vance goes over there and is like, the bureaucrats in Brussels tried to interfere in your election. I won't, but also vote for Viktor Orban, but I'm not here to say. What are you doing, you absolute loser? It's insane. He wasn't doing it to win. [1:03:20] friends. He was doing it to help a friend. All right. If you don't love J.D. Vance at his Victor Orban, you don't deserve him. The most corrupt person ever. Finally, before we get to love its interview with Nithya Raman, one more quick item for you. Well, plenty of political leaders from liberal democracies all over the world posted statements celebrating Victor Orban's defeat over the weekend. One in particular caught our eye from former Canadian Prime Minister Justin Trudeau, not because of what he posted, [1:03:48] But where he seemingly posted it from, Coachella, where the 54-year-old was spotted in a backwards hat with girlfriend Katy Perry in a series of viral photos, which drew this comment from Twitter user, at the departed rat, quote... [1:04:01] When you're fated and need to squint one eye to type, but you're trying to tweet about Hungarian politics. [1:04:09] Do we have the picture? There it is. This picture is enraging. This picture is enraging to me. He looks so vital, young, and happy. He's 54. He looks half his age. Maybe there's hope for 54. I guess. For me, all Coachella is is a great weekend where the traffic is less in L.A.

[1:04:31] living his best fucking life. I like that there's like also a video that's come up too on the screen. Yeah. And he's like, what are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing? What are you doing? Um, I was talking to a Canadian friend today who said Trudeau is getting shit in Canada. I have friends in Canada too. Do you have friends in Canada? We've got lots of friends in Canada. Yeah, go on. Sorry, your ex or something up there. Girl from camp. Uh, because he pushed, I promise I'm from Canada. He pushed for a plastic cup band in Canada. And as you can see there, he's got a red solo cup. That's why he was getting shit. That's one of the reasons. People are also making fun of him for wearing like [1:04:59] relaxed clothes? Do you expect him to be in a blue suit? What are we talking about here? I feel like the backwards hat. He's enjoying some Chinese food in a... [1:05:08] I like Trudeau. He was on Pod Save the World. Check out Pod Save the World. Subscribe anywhere you get your podcasts. [1:05:15] I guess my advice to him would be like, post about Coachella or post about the Hungarian elections. Don't do both. I'm sorry. And you think he needs your advice. Yes, he absolutely does. He is dating a pop star at Coachella. We're fucking here. He's crushing it. He's living the most divorced dad life. He's doing great. He's posting about Viktor Orban, throwing back a ketamine lozenge. He's crushing it. It is a very relatable situation. We've all been there. Oh, no. We've got to do some work. Oh, yeah. [1:05:45] We're looking at Twitter. Here we are in a fun time. Drafted a convention speech from Vegas. He's done it all. Was he just there to see Bieber? Or is that just a coincidence? A lot of the reporting connected them because they're both Canadian. I mean, she's there, so I'm sure she was just there to see everyone and got all the, you know. She's Katy Perry. She's Katy Perry. Yeah. Imagine you tripping balls waiting for a port-a-potty. You're like, Justin Trudeau? I bet he has artist passes. I bet he has the good passes. Oh, definitely. But he's still got a pee. He's got a pee. And that's the thing. We all got a pee.

[1:06:15] He was at Coachella last year, right? But he spoke. Yeah. [1:06:19] Remember that? Yeah. [1:06:21] Yeah, I think it was he opened for Skrillex. Is that the right? God, my references are getting so old. Wow. So old. Nice. It was a bare naked ladies show. We'll be seeing you at 54 with your half-hours. Who was there? Not Wilco. Just Ari wheeling you around. Was Weezer. [1:06:43] Yeah. Hey, buddy. Hey, old man. It's coached down the road. No, no. That's next weekend, pal. [1:06:51] band called no doubt all right it looks fun i wish i was there yeah we're just jealous that's for sure quite very sure yes [1:07:02] For sure. [1:07:05] Levittalks to Nithya Raman about her race for LA mayor. [1:07:17] Pod Save America is brought to you by ZipRecruiter. Did you know that the average employer has to sort through roughly 250 resumes per job opening? Talk about time consuming. Well, if you're hiring, here's the good news. You can now review all of those resumes and applications faster. Thanks to ZipRecruiter. ZipRecruiter has a new feature that instantly shows you the most interested, qualified candidates first. And today, you can try it for free at ZipRecruiter.com slash Cricut.

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[1:09:31] Joining me in studio, she's a city council member and candidate for mayor of Los Angeles. Nithya Rahman, welcome to Pod Save America. Thank you so much for having me. We have a lot to get through. I'm going to go pretty quickly. I also do want to disclose that I've been a supporter of yours for a long time, but I was really excited to see you jump in the race, not just because you're you, but because I thought Los Angeles deserved a big, contentious, hard fought mayoral campaign and we were about to not have one. Yes. [1:09:59] You had endorsed Karen Bass for mayor. Yes. Uh, [1:10:02] She was a political ally of yours. Then literally in the hours before the noon deadline, you decided to run. What happened in the month between endorsing your former political ally and deciding to run against her? Well, the endorsement request had come months prior. So I just want to be very clear about that. It wasn't like an overnight change of heart. But I will say that I had been getting really frustrated with the way that things had been going in the city and in the way that [1:10:32] I really cared about on housing and housing production and the cost of housing, the extraordinary cost of housing here in Los Angeles. I felt like. [1:10:40] The city was actually fighting against state mandates to build housing. The city was fighting affordable housing. And we didn't have any clear direction or urgency around the issue at all on issues like homelessness, where people were demanding accountability. That is possible, absolutely possible to deliver things that I have actually made progress on in my own district and in my limited way as the chair of the committee. We were just not doing on a system wide level and we didn't feel any urgency around it.

[1:11:06] And I feel like that lack of urgency was everywhere in every issue that I cared about. And I kept trying to push back against it and kept hitting a wall. And I think I got increasingly frustrated. And I'm not a traditional politician in that this is what I want to be doing for the rest of my life. I actually didn't even really think that I would ever run for office. But I really care about Los Angeles and the idea exactly like you said of having a mayoral [1:11:36] now, that a lot of people feel like it's moving in the wrong direction, that the city hall needs to be doing things differently in order to address our biggest problems, that we weren't even going to have that conversation. [1:11:47] I mean, it made me crazy. It made me absolutely crazy. And so finally, in the last couple of days, I seriously considered running. And then on the very last day, threw my hat in the ring. So let's talk about what's wrong with Los Angeles, which would be too long of a conversation to have. But stepping back, the city of LA has a budget of around $14 billion. Yet we can't fix sidewalks, [1:12:17] Lamps, why in the richest state in the country, in the fourth largest economy in the world, is Los Angeles such a basket case? You know, I think a lot of it has to do with really poor fiscal management here at the city. We are making decisions that undermine our capacity to be able to deliver money. [1:12:35] basic essential services for our residents. And I think that's a shame because it is, again, it's completely possible to do it. We last year had a billion dollar budget deficit. That is,

[1:12:46] Definitely had some kind of impacts from the fires the year prior and from or a few months prior and from heightened liability claims that. [1:12:59] are impacting a lot of municipalities across the country. [1:13:03] But the biggest issue was that we signed unsustainably large contracts, beginning with the police union, which is one of the biggest players in local politics. We signed an enormous contract with them that everybody at City Hall knew would lead to hundreds of millions of dollars of shortfall. And yet we signed it anyway because the mayor and many other City Hall leaders, I voted against it, many other City Hall leaders knew that the police union is the major player in local elections. [1:13:33] the biggest funders of [1:13:35] independent expenditure committees of campaign funding here in LA. And so we signed that contract. We knew that we would be hundreds of millions of dollars in the hole as a result. And then exactly as everyone knew, we ended last year with a billion dollar budget deficit and 1,600 layoffs on the table. And because that happened, we are now in a situation where we have 30,000 streetlights off across the city of Los Angeles and an average repair time of a year to fix a streetlight. We [1:14:05] a single mile of street this entire fiscal year because we don't have the money. We're filling fewer potholes because we have the trucks to fill potholes, but we can't pay for the drivers. [1:14:14] to fill potholes. We are doing everything worse than we could. And now we're going back to residents and asking them to pay more in order to deliver these essential services. So,

[1:14:24] If you were to become mayor, you would inherit these contracts [1:14:29] uh [1:14:29] How do you fix it? How do we dig ourselves out of this hole? And how do you do it when... [1:14:35] It's not just the mayor that's kind of making these decisions, but also the city council and other people that feel beholden to these groups, even if they're supportive of making sure public employees receive good benefits and good. A hundred percent. A hundred percent. And I think you can offer. [1:14:50] I think we can have a vision for Los Angeles where we are paying public sector employees what they deserve, [1:14:57] giving them raises to be able to live in this city that is so extraordinarily expensive, [1:15:02] but also negotiate adequately in order to make sure that we're also delivering basic services. And that... [1:15:10] inability to negotiate, that's what we're losing in a system which is so insular here in LA, where the people who are really constituents of City Hall politics are a very small group, as opposed to all of the residents of the city of Los Angeles for whom the decisions being made in City Hall really matter. Can you talk about [1:15:29] what happened with [1:15:31] the convention center. So I think this is a good example. There was a proposal to expand the convention center. You just tell people what happened, how much it's going to cost and what happened there. Yeah. So there's been a proposal being kicked around for actually a decade to expand the convention center. We have a convention center in downtown LA. It is pretty old. It's smaller than other convention centers. And there's been kind of a discussion to see whether we should expand it and brighten it up. Suddenly,

[1:15:58] Just a few months after we had a billion-dollar budget deficit, the convention center was back on the table. And by this time, the costs had ballooned significantly. Now the cost of rebuilding that convention center with – [1:16:10] death service were going to be close to $6 billion. $6 billion. That would mean that we were going to be paying out $100 million annually [1:16:20] annually out of our general fund. Those are our discretionary dollars that we use for providing basic services here in LA, everything from public safety to streetlights. And, [1:16:30] That proposal was pushed through very, very quickly, despite the fact that we are in a fiscal crisis, despite the fact that we have the Olympics coming up, despite the fact that local and economic headwinds are very, very uncertain here in Los Angeles, because a small cluster of downtown businesses who fund local elections really wanted to push it forward. [1:16:55] For me, I represent a district right now that is very vocal about their views. It's one of the relatively wealthier districts, and they know how to get in touch with City Hall when they care. I didn't hear from any of my constituents saying that they wanted this project to move forward. [1:17:10] That's very unusual for big decisions in front of the city. How long would the project take to like how many years would it take to build this convention center? It's going to take a couple of years. And what is interesting about it is that we actually have Olympics events that are scheduled to happen at the convention center. And so in order to make sure that the Olympics events are happening, what we have to do is to move the project forward until it gets to Olympics readiness. It won't be done by the time the Olympics are happening, but we need to get to Olympics

[1:17:40] And then we're going to kind of put walls around the remaining parts of the convention that are there still under construction. Then we're going to have the events there. And then afterwards, we'll finish the project. And that's going to cost $6 billion. With debt service. With debt. Yeah. So including all the costs plus the borrowing and all the rest is going to cost $36 billion. And how long would it take us to make back that $6 billion? I mean, we're going to be paying the debt for that for the next 30 years. And the revenues will never cover the costs. I mean, this is... [1:18:06] Terrific. [1:18:08] Love that for us. All right. Sorry. So how does it get to the point where a small group of people, Democrats or, you know, left associated people are all coming together to make these decisions, not Republicans that are causing these problems. It's not Donald Trump. It's this is a problem generated by the only thing between us and solving these problems is Democrats. Right. And so for people that maybe aren't from Los Angeles and see this, like, what have you learned being in the city [1:18:38] That are maybe ideologically aligned to care about just the basics of good governing. You know, I don't know the answer to that, to be honest with you, because that is not what we have right now here in Los Angeles. So I don't know what the solution for actually caring about good governance is, except that. [1:18:53] I think it is it is absolutely necessary at this moment to me here to live in the city, to think about the fact that I have to look my constituents. [1:19:04] in the face and say to them, you trust me, I'm going to address really complex issues like affordability. I'm going to address really complex issues like homelessness, but I can't fix your streetlight for a year.

[1:19:16] And just trust me, I got this. That felt unacceptable to me. That felt like an absurd situation to be in with my constituents. And that is really what had... [1:19:26] what pushed me into running. And, you know, at this time I had actually been so frustrated with the way that things were going that, uh, [1:19:35] I have started to lose hope in in in how things could get better here in Los Angeles. And I think in the context of a federal environment where I feel relatively helpless and hopeless as well. [1:19:47] Feeling that locally has also been really, really frustrating. But I will say that since I started the campaign and since I've been going out and talking to communities about these decisions and talking about how the city can do better, how we can achieve all of the goals that we want to set out to achieve if we're honest with our constituents, if we're open, if we're transparent. [1:20:17] that I can meet their friends, like it is a message, [1:20:20] that [1:20:21] is getting a lot of positive reception, which is really exciting. So let's talk about one of the key challenges for LA, which is housing. I actually interviewed Zoran Mamdani about this when he was running in New York, that he had actually evolved as somebody that was associated with the DSA, the socialists, democratic socialists, that he had come to see the importance of not just like rent control and measures to control the cost of housing, public housing, but also housing.

[1:20:47] market rate housing. I think you've had a similar evolution. Can you talk about [1:20:52] uh [1:20:53] What is standing in the way right now of Los Angeles building enough housing supply to meet the need? Yeah. I mean, I think I definitely had that same movement. I was very focused on affordable housing when I first started my first race, building more affordable housing, building more shelter, making sure that we were building kind of what we're doing. [1:21:15] people talked about needing here in LA. But as I was in office and I started getting calls from constituents who were struggling with their rents, I realized these were often people who would never qualify for affordable housing, but they had no choice but to live in a unit with a terrible landlord in terrible conditions because there was simply nothing else available to them here in Los Angeles. And LA is a city where there has been an active anti-housing movement that has [1:21:45] decades. In the 80s, there was an anti-Manhattanization movement that downzoned, that reduced the capacity to build more housing along every major boulevard and thoroughfare, that reduced capacity to build multifamily housing across the entire city, leading to what is an estimated shortfall of something like 500,000 units here in the city of Los Angeles right now. [1:22:10] But I think we can actually fix it. There are ways in which the city of Los Angeles can build more. A huge change would be getting the city out of the way, rezoning so that we actually have capacity to build more housing, building more density, particularly near our major transit corridors, building more gentle density like duplexes and triplexes, even in some single family neighborhoods that can be more walkable that are near transit.

[1:22:40] enormous red tape standing between an application for a new housing unit coming in and when it is actually approved. And our timelines for approving housing are double, even triple what other jurisdictions are, which leads to significantly less housing being produced. And by the way, more expensive housing being produced because the longer you have to sit and wait for your permits to come, the more expensive that housing becomes ultimately. And the fewer projects that get started because the people building those projects know they have to be able to make money [1:23:10] - Yeah, I also wanted to say that we really have a culture in City Hall where delay and denial are [1:23:20] kind of rewarded and saying yes is not. And I think we have to completely flip that around. We have to build a city where saying yes is the goal of our housing processes, not the opposite. And that is a culture shift that has to happen at every level of the bureaucracy. It has to be enabled and undergirded by technology that allows cooperation between departments, and it has to be rewarded at the highest levels of government. And that's really what I think needs to happen. [1:23:50] um [1:23:50] There was this sense, even from the mayor, that we're going to make this process faster, we're going to make it work better. [1:23:57] Of the 4,100 that have applied for permits to rebuild, fewer than half have been approved. Only 34 homes have been approved. [1:24:05] built. So even when there is impetus, even when there seems to be an understanding that we need to move faster, it's not happening. Is that...

[1:24:12] a technical problem of the rules? Is that leadership? Is that the mayor not like what's happening? Well, I think it is leadership. I think it is a I think the mayor here in the city of Los Angeles has, while it is a weaker mayor system than in other places, we the mayor has the capacity to hire and fire every department head. And that means that the mayor has the capacity to determine the priorities of every department. They're getting motions and legislative efforts from [1:24:42] direction. The mayor is the one that departments respond to. And so it is up [1:24:47] to the mayor to set housing production and permitting timelines as a priority. She can set deadlines for by when these things have to happen. You can appoint leadership that is responsive to those goals. You can create metrics through which you can hold department heads accountable. And if they meet those goals, you can reward them. And if they don't meet those goals, you should replace them. That is not happening here in the city of Los Angeles at all across all of the departments [1:25:17] process. [1:25:18] Also, we haven't had a deputy mayor of housing for almost two years in a city where the cost of housing and housing production and rebuilding are key issues for housing. [1:25:28] This city, we need a deputy mayor for housing. But, you know, that position has been left empty for, I think, an inexcusably long time. So we're in this crisis in housing. We've lost 54,000 people in the county. Now, Los Angeles passed something that's called ULA. It's the mansion tax. Yes. People would know it. Yeah. And I actually supported the mansion tax because I thought, OK, like, I don't think it was it was written in a stupid way by people who seem honestly, like mathematically illiterate.

[1:25:58] And I thought all things considered better to have it than not have it. I didn't understand when I voted for it, honestly, that it also applied to multifamily housing because that was so I wouldn't even have occurred to me that it would do something so fucking stupid. Truly, I feel stupid that I voted for. I would have voted no. You tried to fix it. And you say, hey, we'll keep the mansion tax, but we won't apply this to new multifamily housing because all the evidence says that multifamily housing is being stopped and this is counterproductive. [1:26:26] And yet the council doesn't do it. [1:26:29] I, what is the, like, it was enraging. I am mad sitting here. It doesn't, what is the logic of it? How do you, how, how do you show up with these people and not like, what is stopping them from doing that? Like sputtering to a stop is so fucking stupid. Why didn't they support what you were trying to do? Well, I mean, I think because people, A, people don't believe the evidence. So there's there, I mean, I, I was very convinced by the evidence. There were real differences in LA city versus LA County. LA County is producing more housing. We're producing less [1:26:59] macroeconomic conditions that we are is actually increasing permits while LA has seen a 25% drop in permits. I mean, to me, the evidence was very clear that this was impacting multifamily housing production. I think there's two things that are happening here that are preventing more robust action from being taken on issues that are obviously addressing housing production. One is that there is significant pushback from, again, those same kind of insider groups that have huge

[1:27:29] with very closely to try and negotiate a pathway forward. I was talking to them for many, many months to say, because I too was a supporter of ULA, I really value the money that it provides to the city for rent relief and other things. And so I worked very closely with them to say, hey, can we craft an exemption that allows for this much needed housing to be built here? Ultimately, we just were not able to come to an agreement on what that would look like. [1:27:59] that is, [1:28:01] you know, hampering our future resiliency that is making Los Angeles into a place of less opportunity. Secondly, I think both labor groups that funded the effort also were not on board with making any changes. And so with nonprofits and with labor groups that had supported the effort not making any changes without a real push from the mayor and from other leadership to really move this forward, this effort died. It is now going through a committee process, but I'm not [1:28:31] half the council had already endorsed Karen Bass before he decided to run. They've, I think, all stuck with their endorsements. But I assume behind the scenes, others on the council are as frustrated as you are. You happen to have also been somebody that endorsed Karen Bass, but was unhappy. [1:28:46] Are you hearing from them? [1:28:48] privately that they actually want you to win but they're afraid to say so publicly well i i [1:28:54] Look, I don't want to betray my private conversations. I still have relationships with people on the council that I'm working with. And, you know, whatever happens in this election, either outcome, I will need to work with them going forward as well. But I will say that, you know, I interact with a lot of local political figures here, not just people on the council, but across the entire country.

[1:29:13] region and [1:29:16] I think there have been a lot of questions about... [1:29:19] kind of the lack of leadership on issues. And I think that's the most perplexing thing here in LA, which I think, [1:29:28] Angelenos can feel on the streets, which is just like a... [1:29:31] There's a rudderlessness. There's just a lack of... [1:29:36] pushing. There's a lack of urgency on the things that I feel really urgent about. And that I think [1:29:42] residents of the city feel really urgent about. There's a lack of just kind of being out there [1:29:48] And fighting like Angelinos need a fighter at a moment when things feel really bleak here. And to not have that fighter in City Hall, to not have that person fight. [1:29:59] really articulating a vision of how things could change, whether it's on the cost of housing, whether it's on our transit and safety infrastructure for our streets, whether it's on homelessness, whether it's on ICE, whatever it is. [1:30:13] We're just missing that. [1:30:15] kind of that leadership here in the city. And this is an incredible place. This is an incredible place. It deserves that kind of leadership. It deserves that kind of vision. It deserves someone pushing with all of their might to push it in the right direction. And I just... [1:30:32] I know I felt that absence and I don't think I'm the only one. I really don't. So I want to ask you about MacArthur Park. There's a beautiful park in the middle of the city. Yeah. Yeah. [1:30:41] If you go there right now, if we drove there right now, it's the middle of the day, you would see...

[1:30:46] basically like an open air drug market. And the mayor and the police, they set up chain link fences on the sidewalks around the park. They're blocking off. They're not cordoning anything in. They are [1:30:59] it's hard to believe that this is the solution. They have built boxes of chain link fence [1:31:05] to close the sidewalk so that people do not use those spaces to sell drugs. This was touted as a temporary solution. Years it has been devolving. There was a plan for like about $27 million to try to beautify the park over a long period of time. You're the mayor of Los Angeles. [1:31:25] How long does it take until MacArthur Park is a place that's safe for families? Is it a, I don't, I personally like, look, I can be told why I'm wrong, but the idea that it's a six month problem as opposed to a one month problem, two week problem to really kind of make the place safe again, like what, what would you do and how long do you think it takes with real attention to make a place like that? [1:31:46] reflective of the kind of city we think Los Angeles should be. [1:31:49] Yeah, I think it would take six months to a year to change it because I think it takes repeated engagement and presence in that location to address longstanding issues. And I think you have to address both issues. [1:32:01] The homelessness crisis that is... [1:32:03] on the streets, you have to address the mental health issues that are out there, and you have to address very obvious issues. [1:32:10] criminal activity that's happening there, drug dealing and other kinds of things for which you need police presence there.

[1:32:16] dealing with really [1:32:18] ugly issues that are out there that require their attention, investigation and arrests. And I think [1:32:25] If you do both of those things, if you are really, again, robustly engaged, um, you know, [1:32:31] pushing with all your might on that issue. I do think that you can make some real improvements there. [1:32:37] we have had [1:32:39] in Council District 4 where I've been engaged. [1:32:44] We don't have anything that resembles that scale of crisis. But we did have very large encampments, very, very large encampments, 30, 40 people that were there when I first got elected. [1:32:55] And each of those addressing each of those took that kind of effort. We were able to offer shelter services, housing and and really push on the system to be able to address issues. There were cases where we had to work a much longer time to address people who had severe mental health issues, who. [1:33:12] you know, [1:33:13] despite repeated engagement, even arrests that came about from their own behavior would end up right back in the same place. That requires engaging with the Department of Mental Health. That requires engaging with mental health clinicians. [1:33:26] It takes time. But again, with time and effort, progress can happen. And I think the key, the missing link here, the thing that I keep articulating over and over again, is that you have to put in the time and the urgency and the leadership and the focus on these things that can actually push things in the right direction. And it has to be sustained over time. Yeah, because what I'm hearing too is like a lot of this is pushing back even at times

[1:33:56] for the unhoused. You know, Gavin Newsom, it's almost taken as a given in some quarters that Gavin Newsom was performatively cruel in the way that he wanted to clear encampments. But, [1:34:10] But at the same time, I imagine most [1:34:13] even Democrats in California would say, "Oh, that's what I want. I want someone who's going to be aggressive about doing that." Is part of the job of mayor [1:34:22] Mm-hmm. [1:34:23] making decisions that are humane, that are reflective of our values as progressives. But at the same time, sometimes the advocates are going to be out there protesting if you do need to clear an encampment, or sometimes you are going to have to go against a labor union, even if you broadly support unions. I think that for me, on the issue of encampments or the issue of homelessness overall, I think [1:34:48] To me, I think it is... [1:34:50] And actually, let me take a step back, whether whatever issue that we're talking about here, here in the city of Los Angeles. [1:34:56] I think the issue for me as a person who is deeply progressive, as someone who believes in the power of government to do good things and to make our lives better, my goal is to ensure that [1:35:08] You as a resident of Los Angeles and every resident of Los Angeles feels like the government is working for them and that they can they can palpably feel the positive presence of government in their lives. [1:35:20] And I think you have to do what it takes in order to deliver those results. On homelessness, I happen to believe that

[1:35:27] - Yeah. [1:35:29] for the for kind of the encampments that I've dealt with in my district housing shelter services focused work has been what has reduced homelessness significantly in in street homelessness significantly in my district at almost every encampment that we've worked in. And that is the work that I would be doing is create that system of sustained effort to generate results. [1:35:53] on [1:35:54] reducing street homelessness, on addressing mental health issues, on making our streets safer, cleaner, brighter, fixing streetlights, whatever it is, you have to push on these issues. And I think that that is really, I think, for me, my goal. [1:36:11] governing principle as a as an elected representative and as someone who is a very proud progressive is like I want people to feel like the government is working for them. When you're on the council, you supported what would become Mayor Bass's signature organization. [1:36:24] policy to address homelessness. It was a $300 million program to get people off the streets. [1:36:31] The city spent about $259,000 per person housed. 40% of the participants, more than 2,000 people, ended up back on the streets. What went wrong with that program? And what does it tell you about how you do it differently? So initially, I thought the kind of the emergency response process [1:36:53] of the Inside Safe program. [1:36:55] was necessary for LA. I also supported declaring a state of emergency on homelessness. I think street homelessness is a crisis. It is an emergency, and we should respond to it at that scale. And

[1:37:08] the kind of effort that it was where you, again, you, it was renting hotel and motel rooms and using those as shelter to go to encampments and get, offer that shelter and then moving an entire encampment off the streets. That's called encampment resolution. It's not unique to Inside Safe. It's something that I've done in my district. In fact, we did it [1:37:26] You know, years before the mayor came into office, we've done it in Venice. It's been pioneered across the city and it's very effective by really focusing encampment by encampment and offering real shelter to people that were able to actually help. [1:37:42] move people indoors and then clear those encampments and then those areas stay clear because you've actually addressed the reason why people are on the street in the first place. So to me, that kind of an encampment resolution focused response is really important. The issue becomes when the intervention that you're using is enormously expensive and you're not doing the work to ensure that you are making it into a fiscally sustainable response. So inside safe motel rooms cost an average of over $80,000. [1:38:10] per person or per room, per person, per year, and people are staying in them for an average of a year. And sometimes they're costing as much as $100,000 per person per year. That is an enormously expensive intervention that I think was appropriate as an emergency intervention, but needs to be made into a real fiscally sustainable system that actually can respond to the crisis on our streets with the dollars that we have, because this is not sustainable.

[1:38:40] want to build that system. I've actually in the city generated data about the performance of our homelessness investments for the first time working with LASA that shows us where beds are vacant, where our permanent supportive housing units are available. And through that work, I've actually brought people into these beds, filled every bed, filled every unit. We need to be building a system which is [1:39:04] costs less per person, but is actually working better at actually bringing people indoors, filling every bed, filling every resource, and then doing the work when they're in those units and those shelter beds to get them the case management they need to transition to whatever is their next step, whether it's reunification with family, whether it is moving into a permanent supportive housing unit, whether it is coming into self-sufficiency, getting a job, being able to actually live independently. These are all things that the system can do. [1:39:33] But you have to design that system. You need to make sure that there is leadership there and resources to create that system to make sure that people are moving through it into safety and permanent housing appropriately. But that kind of work is not happening right now, despite. [1:39:49] Despite the [1:39:50] pushing within the city to create oversight, to create responsibility here. [1:39:55] All right. A couple final questions. Look, I realize that as mayor of L.A., the Middle East has very little to do with your portfolio, but you've been... [1:40:05] Hit from the left for not speaking out enough about Gaza. You also would be running to be the mayor of a city with a very big Jewish population that is deeply concerned about the way in which anti-Zionism bleeds into anti-Semitism. What do you view your role is in speaking about this issue? And what do you think people in Los Angeles should know about Gaza?

[1:40:28] how you feel about it? Well, you know, I have spoken about, spoken up about the issue in the past. I called for a ceasefire, introduced a ceasefire resolution in city council. I've called what's happening there, which is incredibly horrific to witness what's happening in Gaza. I've called it a genocide. And, you know, I've been deeply disturbed by what I have seen. At the same time, in my role as city council member, and what I imagine in my role as mayor would be [1:40:55] the impacts on people who, [1:40:58] Um, [1:40:58] here and kind of the knock-on effects from what's happening in the Middle East, I think, have to be also the focus of our work here in the city. So in my district, we've had increases in really horrifying incidents of anti-Semitism and Islamophobia, and I've had to respond to both of [1:41:22] I would need to do more of that. I would need to ensure that the city is a place where people are able to express their political opinions freely, where people are able to express their First Amendment rights, but that they are not victims of anti-Semitism and Islamophobia. And when those happen, we have to speak up about it. We have to make sure that this is a place that's safe for everyone. I want to talk about the film industry briefly. There's so much to talk about. I know. So L.A., [1:41:45] We had only 19,000 on location film and TV production days. That's a 16% decrease in 2024. That's the lowest number of production days ever recorded outside of COVID. What would you do as mayor?

[1:42:00] to bring production jobs back to this city that Mayor Bass hasn't been able to do. [1:42:05] Yeah, you know, one of the big things that I think we need to be doing is making it easier to film here. And there have been some efforts that are making their way through the council, [1:42:16] around kind of reducing restrictions on how production happens, on reducing costs for production, how improving how Film LA works. These have been moving, I think, all too slowly. There's no reason why through executive directive, these fixes can't be made immediately. And that the bureaucracy that's standing in the way of people producing here, actually making films here, cannot be eased more quickly by a mayor who is deeply focused on this issue. But I think there's [1:42:46] You know, last year we had a conversation about a tax credit that increased, you know, [1:42:50] You know, I wanted to see more advocacy from our mayor for a tax credit that would have no cap and that would be guaranteed a decade into the future. Right. That's the kind of system that studios are looking for as they're thinking about where to invest. And L.A. should be the loudest advocate. The leadership of L.A. should be the loudest advocate for the kind of tax credit system that other states are putting into place. [1:43:13] actually getting production moving there, like in New Jersey. We should be advocating for that same system here. Okay, Sacramento may not listen, but the leadership of Los Angeles should be fighting as hard as they can to make sure that that tax credit system is put into place. I would also say that, you know, I think we need to be really engaging with studios.

[1:43:31] We need to be engaging with companies that are headquartered here and saying to them, what do we need to do to make sure that you're shooting here? What do we need to do to make sure that we are having production stay here? How can we make sure that this industry, which is so central to Los Angeles, so central to Los Angeles, stays in Los Angeles? How can we make sure that the incredible talent that we have across this city can work here? [1:43:54] Up. [1:43:55] place that they moved to, to build their dreams, to work in the film industry. I think that's, that's the kind of engagement that I want to see. I haven't been seeing that kind of engagement happening. That's what I would want to do if I were mayor. Oh, and then can you reopen the arc line? [1:44:06] Oh, I don't know if I can. I would love to figure out why it's closed for so long. What's going on with the archive? I don't know. It's nuts. Yeah, let's go talk to that property owner. Okay. [1:44:16] All right. Made some progress today. Yeah. All right. Thank you. If you're on. And thank you so much for being here. Good luck in your race. I hope we get the open. [1:44:23] All right. We're done. Thank you. Thank you. [1:44:29] That's our show for today. Thanks to Nithya Raman for coming on. Dan and I will be back with a new show on Friday. [1:44:39] If you want to listen to Pod Save America ad-free and get access to exclusive podcasts, go to crooked.com slash friends to subscribe on Supercast, Substack, YouTube, or Apple Podcasts. [1:44:48] Also, please consider leaving us a review. That helps boost this episode and everything we do here at Crooked.

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